Serotonin reuptake inhibitors

[agogoboots]

I've tried to take this class of drugs twice. First Wellbutrin, and now Effexor.

I can tell it could have very positive effects for me if I could ever get beyond the "getting on it" phase, but initially it is horrible, and frightening. I took one 75 mg Effexor and just went through 15 hours of living hell. I'm too scared to take it again tonight. I think I made it 4 days with Wellbutrin.

Has anyone ever had success taking Effexor? Any Serotonin reuptake inhibitors? When does it get better?

If you haven't ever taken Serotonin reuptake inhibitors and your doctor prescribes one BE FOREWARNED!!

[tekobari]

Effexor is kind of old school. Why don't you try the British-developed Celexa? While it's an SSRI, and thus can have the same side effects as any of them, it was designed to have fewer. There are so many out there that giving up after trying two old school ones isn't giving them a fair chance. No one uses Wellbutrin for depression anymore. I mean, no one. It's usually used to break drug habits, like trazadone (Desyril...however it's spelled), or OCD (for which Paxil is excellent).

Did you go to your family doc? I've found that they tend to prescribe what they're comfortable with--older drugs that have been around a while that they've had a lot of experience with in their case load.

You need a specialist for this, meaning a psychiatrist. S/he'll know state-of-the art drugs, be able to titrate the intake practically to the molecule, etc. You may need a "cocktail" of drugs precisely calibrated to your biology. A family doc, while wonderful, just doesn't have that training. I would never fool around with a family doc and psych meds. That's just me. There's a stigma with a psychiatrist, true, but you have to be smart about these things and forget the stigma.

If your HMO won't pay, it's certainly worth it to eat beans and rice for a month and pay yourself. I'm quite serious about this. Good luck, and keep your chin up. You really can feel better. Promise.

[sadie999]

Some interesting info on this class of drugs at Wikipedia. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_serotonin_reuptake_inhibitor)

This portion:

SSRIs have been the focus of controversy. Some feel that SSRIs are prescribed by overzealous doctors or psychiatrists in cases where their use is only marginally indicated. According to this argument, societal pressures have created a precedent for the pursuit of "normal" mental or emotional functioning by chemical means versus a more holistic approach (diet, exercise, sleep, stress reduction, etc).

Kind of sums up my feelings about anti-depressants in general (general, not for psychotic or the kind of depression that makes functioning impossible). Which doesn't mean I'm putting anyone down who takes these drugs. Just that for me, my moodiness and downs are just as valid as my up days.

When my brother died, my doctor gave me Prozac. It seems like everyone was taking that back then. I had violent nightmares and woke up screaming - things I'd never experienced before I took them, or since I flushed them down the toilet. Plus, they made me emotionally numb. I figured being depressed or sad when someone you love dies is normal, and not a reason for drugs.

One of the best cures for me when I'm having a blue (or a black) day is to exercise to exhaustion, take a hot shower, sleep the sleep of the dead, and wake up and make a big pile of scrambled eggs.

Again, what's good for me isn't necessarily good for everyone, and the warning is a good one. My mom's antidepressants are often changed when they stop being effective.

Peace.

[tekobari]

What Sadie writes is apt. Is a person "blue" due to exogenous events, or truly depressed from them? Biological depression is a completely different animal; however, the same neurological pathways are involved.

After a time of bad events, the brain reacts the same as if it were in a biological depression. The neurotransmitters go through the same pathways. You really can bring on a true, clinical depression by reacting to life events in a depressive way. The differences are 1. the cause, and 2. the prognosis. Endogenous depression will always recur without lifelong treatment. Each incidence of depression makes the disease harder and harder to treat. At some point, it becomes nearly untreatable for many people. It has a 20% death rate.

Exogenous depression--life events--has an excellent prognosis. Counseling alone, medication alone, some lifestyle changes, etc. can have very beneficial effects. I'm not a Scientologist. I'm a scientist--it's my training. I don't believe these drugs are evil. They've helped hundreds of thousands of people world-wide back to health. Back to normality. But in a mild depression--even a moderate one--things such as Sadie suggests can, and do, work. I'd try them before meds, if you are willing to work that way. Most people aren't. Depressed people least of all, because they feel hopeless and lack energy.

With suicidal thoughts, there's no substitute for meds.

There's no excuse for psych meds in grief. That's just crazy. Bereavement is normal. In someone with endogenous depression, however, drugs may have to be moderated for a while. A normal person needs nothing but time. In fact, I have a feeling that avoiding grief is kind of sick in and of itself.

I'm getting kind of random here, but I have a migraine. :2headspin Always fun on a Saturday morning.

[agogoboots]

After reading this about people trying to get OFF it, and what last night was like trying to get ON it, I don't think I will be trying any of these drugs again. Over 10,000 people have signed this petition saying they can't get off Effexor due to horrible withdrawl. I don't want any part of that.
http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?effexor&101

I don't usually use medications period. I take something over the counter for a headache, maybe a cold remedy, and that's it for me.

I do have horrible headaches that are increasing in frequency and duration and there's a strong connection to my menstral cycle as they worsen severly then. I have bouts of depression where the sun is shinning and there's either a dark cloud over me, or the light just makes my head split. Most days I can manage but as of late the headaches are interfering with life. I'm having to spend too much time in bed or else being very careful not to trigger it. If I am PMSy, even walking up the stairs with a laundry basket can set off a 3 day have-to-go-to-bed headache.

Just had a physical. Still waiting the pap and mamogram results. Every thing else was fine ....blood sugar, blood pressure, etc. My cholesterol was a little high and that's all.

I am very scared of anti-depressants now. Last night was horrible.

I'm taking fish oil for the cholesterol and they say that can help with depression as well. I don't know about the headaches. They are tension/stress headaches I suppose. Severe on fire buring that starts in the back of the head then consumes my brain. It's very frustrating.

[agogoboots]

Did you go to your family doc?

OB-GYN. I don't have any other doctor. I see him once every 1-2 years.

I don't have an HMO, insurance, etc.

[tabbinosity]

Terri, the association (worsening) with your menstrual cycle and sunlight making your head feel like it's splitting sound like you ought to be evaluated for migraine. The pain of migraines can be excruciating and dealing with excruciating pain can certainly cause things like depression and anxiety. But attempting to treat for depression and/or anxiety without first treating for the headache pain strikes me as putting the cart before the horse. Maybe you'd be less depressed/anxious if you didn't hurt.

The majority (75%) of migraine sufferers are women, and for at least half of female migraine sufferers there's a strong hormonal connection. (I used to get them twice a month, at mid-cycle and with my period.) There's also a seasonal connection -- migraines are often more prevalent and more painful during the spring.

Excedrin (aspirin with caffeine) is a pretty good OTC remedy which I always found helpful if I took it early enough in a headache, "early enough" meaning when I felt the first twinges. It doesn't make the migraine process go away, but it does relieve the pain while the migraine is going on and can make it possible to move more quickly through the migraine process. It's sometimes necessary to keep taking it every four hours or so until you've gotten through the whole headache.

There are also some herbal remedies that might be useful, specifically feverfew and milk thistle. If feverfew is going to help (and it didn't help me), it could take up to three months to realize benefit. Milk thistle is used for liver support. American medicine doesn't make the connection between the liver and migraines, but the nickname for migraines in European medicine is "liver headaches" and Chinese medicine also connects the liver, as well as the gall bladder, to migraines.

Imitrex (a prescription migraine drug) has gotten a lot of press and apparently is very helpful for some migraine sufferers, but it's not for everyone. (It can increase the heart rate of some users.) Catapres (clonidine) and Inderal (propranolol) are blood pressure medications which have been used successfully to treat migraine and also anxiety disorders, and might be worth looking into.

There is a connection between migraine and high blood pressure and also increased risk for stroke later in life. Your blood pressure might have been fine when you had your physical -- mine always was until I was a little older than you are now. But when I was diagnosed with high blood pressure about five years ago and started on appropriate treatment, my migraines almost completely disappeared. On the very rare occasions when I feel one coming, plain aspirin is often enough to cut it off at the pass if I catch it early enough.

I'm concerned that with the advent of drugs like Lilly's Cymbalta, which is advertised as being able to treat depression and its "painful physical effects," there is going to be even more of a push on to give people "head meds" for physical problems. Conditions like clinical depression do call for appropriate medication, but using antidepressants to treat someone who is trying to cope with an undiagnosed or improperly diagnosed medical condition? Family practitioners aren't qualified to evaluate and treat clinical depression -- if they were, they'd be psychiatrists.

I'm no doctor, I don't even play one on TV. I'm just a third-generation migraineur who knows they're not "all in her head" and who's leery of how quickly many physicians want to turn real physical problems into psychiatric problems when it's a woman who's not feeling well.

Hope you get some relief soon.

[tabbinosity]

OB-GYN. I don't have any other doctor. I see him once every 1-2 years.

I don't have an HMO, insurance, etc.

An ob/gyn who hasn't considered migraine but wants to give you SSRI's? :1eek2:

[Heartland]

I tried Wellbutrin to stop smoking, and had a terrible time with it. The first week was okay, the second week was hell ... nightmares, itching all over, insomnia. It worked great to stop smoking, if it didn't have all those side effects.

[agogoboots]

Thank Tabbi. I'm not sure if it's migraine or tension. I just know it's very painful and frustrating.

My little child has been diagnosed with cyclic vomiting/migraine syndrome. She only has it on waking. Almost every day, last about 1 hour. She sees an aura (I do not), vomits violently (I do not), severe pounding headache. She is 9 and has a terrible, terrible time since age 3. We have tried several things for her including propranolol and benadryl and been herded through the neurology department of a teaching hospital once.

Nothing has worked and we can't seem to find competent medical care for either of us. I am seriously reluctant to have her on anti-seziure medication or any of the anti-depressants. Medicines in general scare me. Doctors seem to just be pushing whatever randomly without regard to what they actually do.

My other child has never had a headache to speak of and neither did I until after age 35.

I appreciate your information and kind concern.

[agogoboots]

Someone I know keeps telling me my headaches are due to lack of sex. :1evil2:

[kim]

vitimin b12 - is supposed to help with stress - i take it - it seems to help some - tho - it's really hard to tell...

also - about a year ago - my menstrual cycle - got all wierd - (onset of menopause - but - i'm still having periods - just less often) - and - i get migraines too - anyway - it took about six to eight months - before everything kind of settled down some - (not completely - but - lots better) - and - one of the main things that seemed to help - just keeping me more healthy in general - was that - i started taking - acidophilus - anyway - you can just eat yogurt all the time too - it has the same thing in it - it helps keep ones system in balance...

also - sex - yeah well - i have a lot of sex - and - that does seem to keep me in pretty good spirits... :sm1151:

[sadie999]

An orgasm a day keeps the doctor away. :D (Apples are my least favorite fruit)

And sex for one is better than nothing. (Actually, considering some of the lovers I've had, sometimes sex for one is better than doing it with another person. Ah but I was so much younger then; I'm older than that now.)

Apologies to Bob Dylan for the play on words.

Peace.

[Parklane64]

Try Celexa. It works for me. I no longer torture the wife to find out where she's hidden my guns. :1eek2:

[KatieP]

psssst, Sadie... it was Paul Simon, "The Boxer:"

I am older than I once was
But younger than I'll be; that's not unusual.

[KatieP]

Okay, maybe it was Dylan too. (I listened more to Simon & Garfunkel.)

[sadie999]

The lyrics were all so heavy then. :D

Peace.

[TerrorEd]

vitimin b12 - is supposed to help with stress - i take it - it seems to help some - tho - it's really hard to tell...



Terry started taking a high-potency B-complex capsule every day a few years back. Before that, she had migraine attacks up to twice weekly. She also had some panic attacks once in a while, mostly while driving in St. Louis rush-hour traffic. After six to eight weeks of B-complex, her headaches started to become less severe. She hasn't mentioned migraine in quite some time now, nor has she mentioned panic attacks. Knock Wood! ;)

Here is the product she takes:

Balance B-100 (http://www.swansonvitamins.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10051&SourceCode=INTL097&productId=12578&R=6945&numberOfRows=87&startPage=0&N=4294967184+67&startRowNumber=0&pageNumber=0)

Good Luck coping with the headaches.

Ed.

[agogoboots]

Thanks Ed.

[agogoboots]

I thought of having sex with one Sadie, but when I rolled over and tapped me I heard myself say, "Not tonight dear, I have a headache". :1chirol_r

[sadie999]

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h187/ladytrue_99/rolling.gif

[Pam]

I used Wellbutrin to stop smoking. I didn't have any really violent reaction to it, it did the job on the smoking thing very well. But I felt just enough "off" when I was taking it that I stopped sooner than prescribed, and just did the rest of the ordeal white-knuckled.

Mark and I both took Effexor for a few months during a major upheaval in our lives; we lost weight and became complete insomniacs (well, insomnia is a normal thing for me but not him) but dealt with the upheaval. And neither of us had any problem whatsoever, when we decided we would stop taking it. We did come off it fairly slowly, just in case.

[agogoboots]

That's good to know that it helped somebody Pam. I guess everyone's body reacts differently to different things. After I took it I felt like my body was limp (like a depressant), but my brain was AWAKE, yet I was too disoriented to even watch tv or walk or even sit up most of the time....for 15 horrible endless hours. And I was on the verge of puking the ENTIRE time with this over all freaky feeling I can't describe. I remember that same freaky feeling from the Welbutrin but the Welbutrin gave me energy rather than zoning me out, and I wasn't nauseated with it. I stopped it because of heart palpatations after 3 days. Otherwise the Welbutrin was good. It made me UP and full of energy.

But with BOTH these medications, my reaction was "THIS IS DOING SOMETHING VERY VERY SERIOUS TO MY BRAIN!"
(I hate feeling drugged.)

Tonight I laid out a "headache journal". Actually it's more than that including menstral cycle, food, exercise, suppliments, medication, stress, etc. Just a word or two about each. I am going to keep it for a few months and see if I can discover my triggers, what's working, etc. I've got to find a way to manage this.

I appreciate the input and encouragement from all of you.

[blondieia]

I think Effexor is one of the most dangerous drugs on the market today. My daughter was prescribed Effexor. Not only did it seem to be the drug that pushed her into full-blown psychosis before her suicide attempt, but it was the most physically dangerous of the drugs she deliberately overdosed on.

I also had a friend who never had a single problem with mental illness, whose physician prescribed Effexor for help with symptoms of menopause. The first time she took it she had to pull over to the side of the road and call her husband to come get her because she was having a psychotic episode. She said it was the scariest thing she had ever been t hrough in her life.

[Emily Rose]

I've found Effexor to be very helpful for depression--and the only side effect seems to be that it eliminates hot flashes and night sweats as well. I had no idea that it was controversial!

It's awfully hard to treat or even diagnose depression with anything else going on--like your headaches. They do sound like migraines which are closely linked to hormone levels.

If you are clinically depressed, bear in mind that the SSRC's are very similar, but that a person can have very different reactions to them. So don't give up. But please try to find a psychiatrist even if you have to pay the full cost. You really need someone who knows the field.

Good luck!

[mewsicmama]

I was on Effexor for a while, it didn't help me at all. The doctor (psychiatrist) did wean me off of it slowly. I currently take four meds. Wellbutrin XL, Trazodone, Lexapro and Lamictal. I was originally diagnosed as being severely depressed, but the DX has now been changed to bipolar. My Mom was DXd as bipolar a few years ago - I could have told them that when I was a child. The meds I am taking do help me stay on an even keel and I have stopped spending money excessively (which was a HUGE problem).

I hope they can do something for your headaches {{{{{Terri}}}}}. Does your city/county have a mental health clinic that you could go to for some guidance? It sounds more like migraines to me too. Have you had your eyes checked recently? Having the wrong (too weak) prescription can cause some whopper headaches.

Pain can really depress you - I have a lot of nerve damage (hands/arms/neck) and it necessitates me taking Vicodin (7.5/750) and Soma to help with the muscle spasms. Have had to do that for years and it makes you want to draw into yourself and find a dark place to rest and feel better.

You are in my prayers.

[FLvamp]

Terri ~

I don't normally like to put a lot of personal stuff out, but I'm gonna write a bit here since I've been dealing with this very subject.

I've been dealing with the same stuff for about 6 months. Terrible frightening migranes before Aunt Flo arrives, sometimes 2 days before up to the day after it starts. I begged DH to kill me 3 cycles ago, and apparently I had a bad one at work 3 weeks ago. I don't even remember it, DH had to come bring me home.

Ok. So I went to see my acunpuncturist (Dr. Miller) 5 months ago, and that helped a great deal. She also told me about ice therapy: Place ice on the back of your neck, forehead and on the insides of both ankles for 15 mins each hour until it subsides. Homeopathics work pretty well for me, especially Belladonna.

Last time, however, it was quite bad and the ice wasn't helping so much. She referred me to a friend of hers, an allergist. I was skeptical, but I went anyway.

Turns out migraines have well known triggers. They are many, but in virtually all sufferers who have food triggers, these are the dirty dozen in order of triggers for the most people:
Dairy products of all kinds - including milk, cheese, yogurt, etc.
Chocolate
Eggs
Citrus fruits
Meat - including poultry and fish
Wheat - including breads, pasta and wheat by-products like bran
Nuts, especially peanuts
Tomatoes
Onions
Corn
Apples
Bananas

There are also certain beverages and additives among the worst triggers:
Alcohol, especially red wine
Caffeinatted drinks
MSG (monosodium glutamate)
Aspartame (Nutrasweet)
Nitrates (found in almost all processed lunch meats and bacon)

This all amounts to I've decided to go on an elimination diet. I've cut all these things from my food entirely. Some were no problem at all, but I find myself craving apples.

I stuck to that for 2 weeks and really, honestly, I felt much better after the 2nd day.

The 3rd week I started, 1 by 1, to add these things back in to my food every 2 days. Apples were right away and seem to be no problem. Bananas were next and were ok. So I had some chocolate yesterday. Within an hour I had a headache. :1cryhard: Scratch chocolate.

So, the theory is, for me anyway, that I had been eating some of these common triggers - especially craved the week before Aunt Flo. I also seemed to be keeping my estrogen quite high, so that when Aunt Flo arrived, it would crash and send me into a migraine.

I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed this visit will be migraine free. It's due around 5/31 ... I'll let ya know.

As far as pills - a hell of a lot of mood imbalance and depression is a result of what you eat and hormone balance. I strongly urge you to place the pills on a back burner for now and research nutritional areas first. It's free. ;)

[Luvcats]

Terri, I've been on vacation, didn't see this until now. I took Zoloft for 13 years for fibromyalgia and then one day it stopped working. I tried to struggle along without it, and finally my Dr. put me on effexor. I take 37.5 mg a day. One thing I have noticed, I could take the Zoloft or not, skip it for a day or two, the effexor I have to take every morning or I really know I didn't take it. I've never had a side effect to either Zoloft or Effexor, not one and they really help my fibro.

I don't have any opinion on folks taking them or not, but I must not process serotonin at all, since the antidepressants don't bother me at all, though I do take small doses. I hope you and your youngest daughter both find a good Dr. and something works very soon for you both.

[agogoboots]

Oh my gosh, I just found one thing that helps with the excructiating pain of a back of the neck tension headache. Seems such simple a thing but I wish I had discovered this years ago!

Get a hand towel and wet it with cold water in the center. Put it on the painful back of the neck/head area. Pull it tight for a few minutes this way and that to put pressure on the muscles from different angles. I did every thing from wrap it around my head like a headband, to pulling it tight across the back and shoulder muscles while holding it like a shawl. It zapped the burning heat right out in no time and really reduced the pain. Did it with an extra strength Excedrine but it was the pressure and cold water that helped the most.

Did anybody here say they were presently taking 75mg (capsule) Effexor with success?


terriv@netdoor.com

[agogoboots]

Thank you all so much for the helpful information and participation in this thread.

[justjg]

Sex, lots of good water, and b vitamins sure won't hurt. Perscription drugs can be so friggin scary.

[sadie999]

:You_Smell

[foptiludrop]

Sex, lots of good water...
LOLOL - he's become a salmon!

[MaryNW]

Terri~hi.......
I'd been diagnosed as severely depressed years ago(hell,I knew that)and last month went from 37.5 Effexor to 75.Was on Prozac for years and started trying different combos a while ago.
For the first time since I was 14,I am ME!!I now sleep well,cry normally and bask in the warmth of my new feelings of well-being.I KNEW the real me was hiding somewhere!
Trazedone gave me cotton mouth so severely that it woke me up every hour and gave me the screaming meemies.Wellbutrin was no help.There was a combination of 2 other ones I can't think of that were useless.
Soooooo,Effexor XR has been very good to/for me!

:1clap5: Mary